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Author Topic: 1 year anniversary of PA confirmation: Where I went wrong  (Read 695 times)
pexio
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« Reply #15 on: July 22, 2010, 12:22:42 PM »

Brother T, my battle-scarred comrade-in-arms.  We DID do the best that we could.  We DID give it our all with the little knowledge and the few weapons we had at our disposal.  And, sadly, our marriages didn't survive.  Our wives are gone and our hearts have turned stone cold towards them.  Second chance?  I couldn't care less.  You and I SURVIVED none the less and we are and will continue to be in a better place.

PP isn't about us anymore.  Our stories are written.  Sad stories, one and all, but we ended up "happily ever after" in the end.  The new guys, though, their stories haven't been written yet.  They don't know how to get to "happily ever after" yet.  I stay to help them and I hope that you and the other vets will stay and help too.

You've got some heallng to do yet brother.  I'm guessing that it was very hurtful for you to know that your D19 sang at your ex-wife's wedding.  Take some time away and heal and grow but please consider coming back from time to time to give us a hand.  Good luck brother.
« Last Edit: July 22, 2010, 12:26:51 PM by pexio » Logged

Brixy
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« Reply #16 on: July 22, 2010, 12:47:49 PM »

Poignant stuff in this thread, it reminds me of Wolfe’s quote in Look Homeword Angel:

"You can't go back back home to your childhood ... back home to a young man's dreams of glory and of fame ... back home to places in the country, back home to the old forms and systems of things which once seemed everlasting but which are changing all the time — back home to the escapes of Time and Memory."

If I could impress anything on the new guys, it's that the memorable times in life do not expire when your marriage dissolves.  The ending is painful, the transition is uncertain, but your ability to celebrate life and create fine new memories for yourself and for your loved ones continues on.     
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« Reply #17 on: July 22, 2010, 04:18:52 PM »

Poignant stuff in this thread, it reminds me of Wolfe’s quote in Look Homeword Angel:

"You can't go back back home to your childhood ... back home to a young man's dreams of glory and of fame ... back home to places in the country, back home to the old forms and systems of things which once seemed everlasting but which are changing all the time — back home to the escapes of Time and Memory."

If I could impress anything on the new guys, it's that the memorable times in life do not expire when your marriage dissolves.  The ending is painful, the transition is uncertain, but your ability to celebrate life and create fine new memories for yourself and for your loved ones continues on.     


Wow, Brixy--that's awesome.  That really bears repeating...
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angel
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« Reply #18 on: July 22, 2010, 04:48:47 PM »

Quote
I missed my chance to save my marriage.

Joe,


For what it's worth, the "choose me or the OM" speech may not have saved your marriage.

After I discovered the A, I gave my X two choices:  Either quit her job with her POS boss and be a wife again, or get divorced.  (BTW, this was even before I found PP).

She said she's not quitting her job.  I got on the phone immediately, right in front of her, called the lawyer and scheduled an appointment.  Then I went out in front of the house and took pictures, because I told her I was going to call the realtor and list the house immediately. I told her the kids would probably have to change schools, because we wouldn't be able to live in the town we live in now.

I may as well told her I was going to the store to buy toilet paper. It didn't matter.

I subsequently backed down (bad) but it didn't matter because she picked up where I wavered and filed. I let her do all of the dirty work. 

All I'm saying here is that there is no right or wrong in these situations...some things may work, others may not, some may partially work, whatever.

I hope you never regret not giving her the speech, because I am a case example of it not working.

Mr. Reality made his appearance two weeks after the D when I ignored her on her birthday, not during the "choose me or choose the OM" speech. 

BTW, this is another great thread.





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JoeP88
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« Reply #19 on: July 22, 2010, 05:43:08 PM »

agreed. It may not have done anything.

BUT, it would have been a line in the sand. As Bystander eloquently put it: It gives you an unmistakable roadmap for the future. AND, there will be NO MISTAKE as to why the divorce is taking place.  we didnt grow apart, we didnt mutually decide this. She chose OM over marriage.

And, TN is out on the table. You may not have to go that route. But she knows you can.

You cant make her hit bottom, your shock and awe might give her a glimpse of the floor.

Me, I wanted to believe her. But  alls I did was give her an easy out. thought she would snap out of it. then I appeased. Thought if I put off a divorce, she'd thank me and we'd live happily ever after. So, after our D conversation, it was just a big sense of relief for her. Then not knowing an alien was on the way, I might as well have dropped the smoke to tell the mothership where the land. And while Im doing pretty well, it's been quite a year.

If I could turn back the clock a year, knowing what I know now, my road map would look a lot different. Divorce or not.

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« Reply #20 on: July 22, 2010, 05:45:45 PM »

Okay, an addendum.

Not only do you have to go thermonuclear, but you must FOLLOW THROUGH.

That was where my brother's version of shock-and-awe was lacking too. He should have kicked her out on the spot, no remorse and no second chances when he found out she was still in contact with the OM.

Angel -- did you go ahead and file? Put the house on the market?

These MLCers know you all too well ... they know your soft spots. (See what hopelessinga has fallen for here ... CRUMBS in the hope that the divorce can be postponed.) Roll Eyes
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« Reply #21 on: July 22, 2010, 06:26:34 PM »

Okay, an addendum.

Not only do you have to go thermonuclear, but you must FOLLOW THROUGH.

That was where my brother's version of shock-and-awe was lacking too. He should have kicked her out on the spot, no remorse and no second chances when he found out she was still in contact with the OM.

Angel -- did you go ahead and file? Put the house on the market?

These MLCers know you all too well ... they know your soft spots. (See what hopelessinga has fallen for here ... CRUMBS in the hope that the divorce can be postponed.) Roll Eyes

AMEN SISTER!

THAT FACT...is the key!  Tough Love ONLY works if you follow through...EVERY TIME!  Because it will be tested...a lot...especially at the beginning!  FEAR may drive them to choose you...but that may be nothing more than stalling...and planning a new strategy.  And OH YEAH do the crumbs and the bait come out in the hopes of getting me to lower the shields...and honest to God...if I would not have had Wek around to keep reminding me of what it was I REALLY wanted...I probably would have caved!

The problem in the beginning is that the ILYBINILWY speech, the discovery of affairs, and all of the rest of the joy that hits us at one time...just plain old kicks your ass sideways!  Your world is so upside down that it is difficult to find any sort of reality in everyday life.  So finding the clarity to think and plan a TN type barrage...is just not in most guys right then.  Speaking from my own perspective...mine was done on pure unadulterated RAGE.  The first batch of info kicked my ass...further discovery of just how damn deep that rabbit hole was....PISSED ME OFF!  I remember that day like yesterday...when I called Wek...and to his credit, he pushed me into pushing that Nuke Button.  I got the kids out of the house and unfucking loaded.  So yes...in my case, I know that the TN/Tough Love approach worked.  But that is MY CASE...it will not work for everyone...

But it did give me...as I was told repeatedly...My Navigation Point!  Early On...I knew the path to follow...and I made the appropriate plans and followed through.  Blowing the Affairs & OM's up simply exposes the fire to the oxygen that burns it up.  Blowing it all up just puts YOU in the drivers seat of YOUR LIFE!  Sitting around...waiting, hoping, and fondly remembering the past while pining away for what you've lost....is like being LOST...you get no where and its scary as hell.  Setting a NAVIGATION POINT...allows you to Move Forward!

Like Pex said...Blowing mine up saved it for me...but if it hadn't, and she had said Him...well then, I would guess I would be in about the same state of mind today as a single man...JUST FINE!  Its not about winning or losing...Marriage or Divorce...its about STANDING UP FOR YOURSELF and getting back some of the self esteem that she destroyed.  The sooner you do that in this process...the better YOU are...with her or without her!

Joe...buddy, you are doing great!  I cannot tell you how far you have come from the guy who started PM'ing a year ago!  Keep it up!

Good Luck.

BB
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angel
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« Reply #22 on: July 23, 2010, 09:21:22 AM »

Quote
Angel -- did you go ahead and file? Put the house on the market?

No and no.


Regardless, she filed the next week, and I was able to keep the house because the interest rates had dropped enough to enable a refinance after she took her "share" of the equity out.  The D settlement was 50/50 across the board, so there was nothing to debate/argue in court.  The case never even made it to court.

A lawyer told me to be cool around the house and don't make things any worse, don't argue, yell, etc because the settlement I got was so fair, that he "couldn't have argued in court for a better deal." (Or words to that effect).  When word got out to some of my friends on the D deal, they commented that they never had heard of such a thing--that D's were always contentious and the guy always gets screwed.

In my case, the only thing I could have done differently was to file and file hard, asking for the kitchen sink.  Because I'm in a no-fault state, I could not have done any better than what I ended up with. It would have been a complete waste of time and would have fed the legal system with money I didn't have--and possibly would have resulted in losing the house.

My hand was called...and in retrospect, a sustained carpet bombing campaign of shock and awe could have made things worse. 

Like a good poker player, you got to know when to hold em and when to fold em.  I folded, kept my legal costs down to a relative trickle, and got a decent settlement. 

I remember thinking at the time also that this marriage must end--that the basic premise was so contaminated and vile that it didn't deserve to exist.


Having said all of that, however, I do agree with you Bystander (as ususal) that following through on the shock and awe, if you pursue that strategy, is requisite. 

What is important when you are at this stage of the game, for all of us that didn't pursue TN, is that you have no regrets about not doing so...you can't change the past any more than you can predict the future.



 
 
« Last Edit: July 23, 2010, 03:20:50 PM by angel » Logged

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JoeP88
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« Reply #23 on: July 26, 2010, 11:14:06 PM »

where I also went wrong was to not push for the divorce. Pexio once said: If you want to save the M, push for the D. If you want a D, push for the divorce. EITHER WAY, push for a divorce. Dont wait a freakin year like me...

I initially thought that if I kept her away from the lawyers, kept us married through appeasement...she'd snap out of this, thank me, come to her senses and we'd move on. Nope.

However, once I started pushing for the D, Mr. Reality starting showed up in small ways. Very small but I've seen a few small signs..Now, it's just a year in. close to a good divorce agreement and Im actually looking forward to a divorce. It's a goal. Lets get it done. I WANT to be able to say 'Im divorced' - there's no shame in it anymore for me. Never thought a lot of things would happen. But here I am. so lets do it.

in many ways MLC isnt' what it seems. they arent happy. We really arent standing when we think we are. We arent saving anything by trying to avoid D. 

And I feel like I just put myself through hell for this past year. for what?



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It's times like these you learn to live again
It's times like these you give and give again
It's times like these you learn to love again

- Foo Fighters
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« Reply #24 on: July 27, 2010, 09:52:31 AM »

So you could be an example for the new guys on what not to do?  Tongue

My brother had the same strategy as yours early on, JoeP. But, as we all know, appeasement doesn't work.

Here's the moral of the story for the new guys:
If your MLCer won't choose THE MARRIAGE, then get the divorce done AS SOON AS YOU CAN.
NOTHING is gained through delay. The divorce will just cost you more (and the EMOTIONAL cost to you will be even higher than the financial cost.)
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